Yes
No
Remarks:
I know some may and some may not but I will not place out the outcome until a few days pass. Right now I thought I would post out a question to all from all areas and walks of life. I know that some are clannish and some are not. My mission is not to do harm it's to get a feel within these times. I have been polling but that is my own manner. As I was interested to see what all do think. The best I can do is ask everyone on there thoughts on this. I myself have my own thoughts on this and I am sure or certain that you do as well hence the question if I may. And I shall never indicated who said what. I shall only indicated the numbers and that is all. It might be too much to ask but I shall state my thoughts as well on Lybia and they will not be contrived by the means of newspaper.
I know it's much to ask, yet it would be nice to see what others are thinking on this very subject. It merely takes one vote. Nothing more.
* Often I ponder if it's appropriate to do this as I am not trying to turn anyone off by any means.
That I promise you.
Jack
The reality of the situation has gone far beyond protecting some protesters.
ReplyDeleteThe 'protesters' have magically morphed into a Liberation Army, led by a (former) Libyan general officer who met with Hillary Clinton a week before we began the bombing campaign.
My own mind tells me that there was a discussion about the oil continuing to move west - and that was the price of American involvement. Now, we've spent nearly a billion dollars sunk-cost on munitions, personnel and ship/aircraft operational costs, with that figure climbing daily and no end in sight.
Three wars. Weren't the first two enough to teach us a lesson?
If the U.N. would fund and levy troops, that would be another matter. A NATO-led 'coalition' doesn't cut it. Let the U.N. pay for this out of its member funds. That body exists to police the world. Let them do it.
Interesting prospective on this Will as I know you are very well informed on much of this - I am going to leave this go and for now just see if anyone does cast a vote but I do appreciate where you are coming from as your certainly a well studied person.
ReplyDeleteperpetual war = doubleplusgood
ReplyDeleteShall have to change over my computers to hear this I would hope that some to vote as well. I have to switch over but thank you.
ReplyDelete"Attention!
ReplyDeleteYour attention please!
A newsflash has this moment arrived from the Malabar front!
Our forces in south India
have won a glorious victory!
I am authorized to tell you the action we are now reporting may well bring the war within measurable distance of its end!
Here is the newsflash..."
I just hooked up what is this?
ReplyDeletePlease no videos this is objective and nothing more.
ReplyDeleteI'm worried about helping a group of people who will later become(if not already) our enemies.
ReplyDeleteYeah I think many are and I am not doing this for the sake of sensationalizing it as I just hooked this up and thanks for your comment Susan. Valid point. Yet the formal goal of the NATO Libya mission is expressly humanitarian or they say so.
ReplyDeleteAnd now we are attempting to enforce a no fly zone, to prevent Libyan leader Gadhafi from carrying out his threats to kill civilians associated with rebel forces. As it has been declared. Yet western leaders now have made a change to this theme that Gadhafi must go. I ponder where this mission is going and where it will come to be. Something is just wrong with this picture. And where it leads to is one that I do certainly ponder.
I don't think I know enough just now to vote properly. I want to automatically say no...but I think I need to get info.
ReplyDeletei think he is capable of a genocide--and for that i support any limited involvement-----bosnia---i am not a political scholar---i have just seen things i wish i had not.................
ReplyDeleteNo worries Mel as I myself have been pondering this one.
ReplyDeleteThat is for sure however when one looks at Lybia and the other areas that surround it it's something that is a mission of many countries and who would have expected this to come about again something of the likes of Iraq as it's rather close and I don't think there was good planning with this one.
ReplyDeleteYet we allow it to carry on, do think of several factors with this as it's not a well planned mission. I think that would be the stem of it all in my own perception.
We over extended right now and these are all that are involved and I think we may have not made a mistake but the mistake was within the initiatial premise yet it there was much that was not taken into account.
ReplyDeleteI am not well educated on the subject because as a well educated person, I believe that most of what is put out there has been spun very well...I think people who take a strong side consider themselves well educated but truly only pick a side that agrees with their own emotions, whether it is true or not. Anything can be twisted to look like it is the truth, and professed loudly enough, can persuade others that it is the truth. I'm just saying...anyone who believes they know the real truth and then scream it from the rooftops with put downs...really are probably the most ignorant of all.
ReplyDeleteVery true and I am no scholar either - thank you Just Here.
ReplyDelete;)
ReplyDeleteMy response was Remarks. I can't see this as a black/white, yes/no answer. Egypt is still reeling from the changes achieved there, and Libyan refugees add to a system that is still finding its way. Yet, how can innocents be protected? How then do we ignore the Ivory Coast? Other places? Our President gave some guidelines, but those remain vague -- subject to a president's decision. He is our Commander in Chief, too. I wish the world could focus on helping Haiti, Chile and Japan in their natural disasters without having to face the evil men do to each other.
ReplyDeleteIt was very vague and there are many countries that are now involved. I don't claim to know what is right nor wrong but all I do know is that there is a coalition of a few countries and Hillary has had her share I am sure with all of this. It's difficult to say no. And we all aren't. But perhaps there might have been better vigilance with all this. As well the comparatives of Haiti, Chili, and of recent Japan - it's a very different ordeal. I say with respect.
ReplyDeleteI do not know enough to comment properly.
ReplyDeletePeople are killing each other to obtain power over each other. No matter which side, it is not good. We will not have a better world until each one can act according to his own conscience for the highest good.
ReplyDeletei.s., I said that perpetual war = doubleplusgood because I think Orwell's Big Brother is really here. I don't think it's a coincidence that the year the Crown relinquished control of Rhodesia is the same as the year Thatcher started the war to reclaim Las Islas Malvinas from Argentina. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak
ReplyDeleteAm not into politics, Jack. And my answer may cause some laughs, but be as it may ... a big No. Maybe, just maybe ... if we let them [any nations for that matter] resolved their own conflict and let them learned from their own mistakes it will be much better.
ReplyDeleteBig countries may extend their help ... but only if asked. That way, war won't escalate and will be confined only to the warring citizens of that certain country.
Salaam Jack,
ReplyDeleteVoting is difficult because of the complicated conditions behind the scene!
I'm not sure whether the majority of people in Libya are for or against the presence of foreign forces, since the news agenices in west and east do not reflect the same ideas!
All in all, if the achievement of this battle is real liberty (not the influence of some countries in Libya after the war), we can vote for Yes.
Now I understand what you mean Robert and I appreciate this. Interesting if I may say as now I understand what you are getting at and thank you Robert.
ReplyDelete...Jack here.
Salaam Ali,
ReplyDeleteThis is the main concern or at least one of them Ali, I think that this is a primary concern for the President and although America was the leader of this quasy coalition. There is no doubt that Obama wanted to have it look as though United States was merely a participant and not a leader of this coalition. It became apparent that Obama was leading it when he declared outside of the agreement made by the United Nations. He opted on his own to declare that there was now a mandate to take out Omar. Thereafter, other countries followed with the same new change and Canada was then asked to place in a three star and two star general (s) to tend to air and ground. As you know and I do need to back this up I am americanadian. And I voted yes as well as I do believe in aiding people but it took me a long time before I did so. The concern I have is that of economics. As we see one country and then other countries that are right next to Libya and each one right now seemingly has ongoing situations - meaning there is more at stake here. We might be saving lives, but hypothetocially if Omar is killed. Then what takes place with other countries within all of this? Yes many of the GOPs of the Arab League did agree with the United Nations - yet I feel they were just doing so to be politically correct. Look at Yemen, Syria, Egypt (just had a transition), and Ali - even Iran where you come from the people and society are decent very well educated people yet they are not for whichamacallit....your prime minister.
This is why there is much more to consider than just saving lives. I hope there is clarity within what I wrote and if you have the time it would be interesting to get your perception as although we are not from the same culture there are many things that we do share in interest. And I think one is international affairs.
Peace there Ali - and thank you. If you can expand a little it would be interesting to have your more of your perspective. If you wish.
Oui DJ, you would know as your Air Force there is very involved in this as well. I don't enjoy this as well. We won't but do you think there is a chance that we can reach a resolve to this. I know you well and many times I wished to write to you on this and see what your thoughts were as this is not a situation as of the likes of Japan. However it's more complicated DJ, than Iraq was in either the Gulf 1 or Gulf 2 wars.
ReplyDeleteSo I did wish to write something other but having arrived back home. I feel that there must be some solution to this and yet we don't wish to see civilians die.
Merci, DJ...
Faye, I am learning by way of the responces of some here - so no worries.
ReplyDeleteDon't write then many have not touched it so if you don't don't bother Maritess. It's a question and some have made there own respected answers.
ReplyDeleteThanks Jack.
ReplyDeleteI mean it depends to people's beliefs. As you mentioned the cultures are different.
For instance, here in Iran, even protesters prefer to solve the problems without the influence of foreign forces.
Because otherwise when people remove the internal hardle, they face an external one (like Iraq) for example.
But if the culture of people accepts the presence of foreign forces for fighting aganist a dicator, it is OK to get help.
In this case also it depends to the people of Libya, if they accept the help of foreign forces, that's OK, IF they do not face another problem now with some helpers after winning the battle!
That as well is a main concern as what you have indicated here is with regard to and exit strategy.
ReplyDeleteYet if all of this was to come to a finality what country would even dare to take this on? Perhaps this
would be something I think that Will mentioned and it would be something that the United Nations does.
Yet I am not sure how solvent the United Nations are but that is another matter. But the people were
asking for help from America. And thereafter President Obama and Hillary - perhaps Senator Hillary Clinton
was smart enough to organize this in a manner that United States was seen as a participant. And now
the people of Lybia are indicating that they wish to have Omar brought to an Lybian court. Whereas we are
not there yet but if so I would like to see that with all going well - he does not have to face a court. But he
does not exist. ( I think you know what I mean ).
Robert,
ReplyDeleteI need to go but if you do have the time I would really appreciate if you could expand on this in laymans terms.
I really mean that if you have the time.
Jack
no..war cant be the answer..and if we have to go that way we need to a gree and not pull in different directions..
ReplyDeleteWe are within a warzone right now as we speak. We do need something within all this yes.
ReplyDeleteWhat that is I think will come out within other blogs. Needs and wants. I just arrived back after talking with a few
and Tori....I am not sure on this. I can say that without any reserve, within all honesty I don't know the answer.
Nor am I going to ruin this blog on this subject. Yet it's a learning curve.
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ReplyDeleteinsertAudioReply('initiativestain:video:381','upload-initiativestain-381','');
ReplyDeleteIt's not that easy to do this but what I was trying to say I don't know what the answer is and thus I collaborate with the subject matter.
ReplyDelete