I'm conflicted on this question. My first response is, definitely not. It would feel so disrespectful, even denigrating. Next...some of us need to actually see what is happening to people here...to be informed, to be actively involved. But. This would only be combined with an editorial, not used in a theme.
I'll maintain my first response. I would give them something to eat, or money, but NOT an exchange for taking their picture.
Julie, that's exactly what I meant: "Next...some of us need to actually see what is happening to people here...to be informed, to be actively involved. But. This would only be combined with an editorial, not used in a theme."
If I were in the position to do something like this, I'd explain it to them & be sure I had their total understanding & agreement.
not a picture I took myself of someone begging or homeless, I would be too embarrassed to take the photo in the first place, and i think the idea of taking the photo and then giving them a little money you don't need it is patronising, Its not your unwanted loose change they need but a home. But I have done blogs on poverty and homelessness and used photos found on the internet or on other related sites to illustrate what I mean.
Would you take a picture of the mayor and post it without his knowledge? Would you post a picture of your neighbors without their knowledge? Yes? Then you may do the same with a homeless man. No? Then no, you can't.
It's very degrading and very unbecoming if its done for the purpose of just using it for a competition, but if its for a certain subject liked if your into reporting something to bring about their flight then it is alright.
I have shot pictures of homeless people before. Always with their permission and always attached to buying them a meal. In the case of many I have bought more then one meal. Steve, Steven and Ron are 3 homeless men I have photographed, spoken to and sat down and bought them breakfast before. It isn't degrading or disrespectful to take their picture, It is when people treat them as if they were a blight that they are disrespected. To pretend they don't exist brings more disrespect. Cathy is another homeless person I photographed. Including her home in the woods. It was a tent. I took her food every week and sat and talked while we ate lunch together in her home. When she was killed by a hit and run driver the pictures I took of her were the only things her family had for over a year. Knowing that she had a home and someone who was her friend gave comfort to her family.
Believe it or not homeless people have pride in their ability to survive in the wild of the city. They do what many of us would not be capable of doing.
I do some photo journalist work. People usually don't get past a persons homelessness to know the story behind the person. Take Steve and his son Steven. Steve worked at a local hospital in their maintenance staff, until the hospital had cut backs. Before that he had a house with a wife. After he was laid off she got cancer and they didn't have insurance. She ended up on medicare and lived for over a year after diagnosis. For Steve trying to get his wife to chemo and job hunting. Then working a temp job while trying to get her too and from chemo didn't help him get and keep a job. By the time she died he was in a lot of debt and ended up losing his house. He and Steven were on the street. Once you are on the street it's harder to get a job, you don't have an address or a phone number. So they go to the corner where day laborers are picked up. Steve's in his 50s so many people don't want a day laborer his age. Steven is in his early 20's so he gets more jobs. They met Ron on the street and he taught them the ropes. They became good friends,. Ron, Steve and Steven look out for each other. If one gets a day labor job they can all eat for a day. They hope one day they can all get jobs and be able to get a place together. Until then they all sleep in a parking garage at night. The story behind the pictures. The men behind the pictures
No it isn't a paid job. I am currently doing a photo journal piece on the flight 93 memorial and the creation of the permanent memorial. There are many people who blog about the human condition and the plight of humanity to get the story out. In the case of th flight 93 memorial because the day the plane crashed changed so many lives. Not just the families of those on the plane. the people who live in the area have been permanently affected by this act. Yet without a voice, no one knows.
The homeless have no voice but they should. What I have found is that many of the people who live on the streets are not much different from anyone else. Most of us have no idea how close we are to falling over the edge and being next to them in the line at a soup kitchen.
i just went and looked at your blog photo and short of you saying the person depicted was homeless, i would never presume that. all of the bags could also mean plenty of things.
Ok it was a question I posed before I had supper and then I headed out and literally just arrived home ten minutes ago. So I am just reading this it's merely a question. So am reading and placing on my glasses.
I have not seen Heidi's picture and that is a fact, there is no need for me to defend myself with this one nor do I wish to see it, it was a moral and ethical question period.
Since I have no idea what picture anyone is speaking of it is hard to say. It is interesting that it caused this conversation. I find it interesting that taking a picture of a homeless person is viewed as exploitation. Would taking a picture of a person running across the finish line of a race be exploitation? Is taking a picture of a people on a public beach exploitation? In other words if it is something positive or showing someone winning it isn't viewed as wrong, but a person sleeping in a drain pipe or a person with a sign on a street is viewed as wrong. Yet this made everyone who commented think.
taking a picture of someone elses suffering for a contest...yep i have issues with that. im human....
the first homeless i saw was a few months ago in philadelphia.....and i cried for days over it. i ahd my camera in my hand in the car as we drove under the bridge....and it was a photo i passed on taking.
I was not talking about one or any pictures in particular, nor have I seen Heidi's page. I literally just arrived home here and before I had supper and then went out unexpectedly as my cousin called me to go out for a coffee with her and her friend, I literally just got in here Sharon. Perhaps I shouldnt have asked the ethical question.
Frani, I had supper then went out and after participating in PP I had this question, yet in no manner did I look at Heidi's picture. That is honestly the truth and I will not go and see it everyone can see whom visits there page and I never saw Heidi's page in fact I opened this up and in no manner was I pointing anything out, I was really thinking about the homeless and the current theme within PP. Nothing more nor less.
Jack I think it is a good question. I hope people remember it. I am one of those nut jobs who will stop and talk to people. It is when we turn our heads or walk on by that dehumanizes them. These people are people. The get hungry, they feel cold, they hate when someone looks at them and looks away embarrassed to have looked. It is an act of human kindness that allows them to know people still care. Even a cheese sandwich means so much to them. A bottle of water on a hot day. It is the small acts that they appreciate.
I have several still waiting to be looked at but this was a moral question...Tess. This is something to log into but so be it. Once in a while I will ask questions just to see what people think, not just within PP. I am not going to feed a fire and never meant to nor will embark with games played....
I understand that it was only a question. I'm seriously not into games. I was judging this as a morality question. But if my input isn't wanted I won't comment.
well, I reckon that sometimes - things are what they are. On my 3rd tour in raq, I was able to blog sometimes. A few folks asked me to put some pictures on or with my blogs of what "actually happened" over there. Better judgement didn't allow me to post very graphic pictures, however, after some requests, I did post 1 or 2 or 3 pics of some events. They're probably still in some of my 5 albums. I was not asked by anyone to take them off - and so I did not. Graphic is all a matter of one's own thought process. You might think that a soldier may or may not ever get used to seeing some of the things we are exposed to. I can't answer for everyone, but it's always difficult - if you have the time to stop and reason. Much of what we did was training oriented and sometimes it's best to not go back and revisit those events.
Myself, I'd probably not take a picture to share with anyone on a blog, however, I might take a picture of some homeless person if I had a personal interest in his/her situation - but it would be just for me. Kinda difficult to share most of the things I've seen and been exposed to - I doubt I ever will.
If ya see a fellow human in need - and if you can somehow find it in yerself to better their situation - ya owe it to yerself to take care of what needs to be done.
Oh, wow. What could be funny about a homeless person? That was mean. I've been told of an old "joke." "Hire the handicapped, it's fun to watch them work." God. That isn't a funny joke at all. Would YOU be "funny" if you lived in a cardboard box under a freeway? If you had MS? I don't believe this!
I like what you told us, & I thought that somewhere in this thread, I said I'd like to talk with them...understand how they feel. The "intimacy" you express makes much difference. This, too: "To pretend they don't exist brings more disrespect."
I admire what you do. You aren't just shooting pictures of homeless people, you're involved. That's the start, & if more people knew why there are so many homeless, perhaps we could do something about it?
what judgements did I make.....she wrote that she takes photos and provides a meal to do so.... some floks she gives extra meals to and talks to them and learns about them on a more personal basis.
i asked her what it was she did with the photos....as i was curious.
it seems you are judging a conversation that didnt involve you
"adedruid wrote today at 7:38 PM I do some photo journalist work. People usually don't get past a persons homelessness to know the story behind the person. Take Steve and his son Steven. Steve worked at a local hospital in their maintenance staff, until the hospital had cut backs. Before that he had a house with a wife. After he was laid off she got cancer and they didn't have insurance. She ended up on medicare and lived for over a year after diagnosis. For Steve trying to get his wife to chemo and job hunting. Then working a temp job while trying to get her too and from chemo didn't help him get and keep a job. By the time she died he was in a lot of debt and ended up losing his house. He and Steven were on the street. Once you are on the street it's harder to get a job, you don't have an address or a phone number. So they go to the corner where day laborers are picked up. Steve's in his 50s so many people don't want a day laborer his age. Steven is in his early 20's so he gets more jobs. They met Ron on the street and he taught them the ropes. They became good friends,. Ron, Steve and Steven look out for each other. If one gets a day labor job they can all eat for a day. They hope one day they can all get jobs and be able to get a place together. Until then they all sleep in a parking garage at night. The story behind the pictures. The men behind the pictures"
nitiativestain wrote today at 9:32 PM Yes Lucija, I didnt arrive here tonight to degrade anyone. I literally just arrived home an hour ago now."
Tess, you're getting feisty. All of the comments & conversations involve me. You've done this before, & literally put words in my mouth. Sorry, Jack. You haven't degraded anyone, but if Tess is going to be abrasive, (as often she is), I'm leaving. I don't play games.
why wouldn't i take a picture of a homeless person? a person with a disability? a person that's fat? a person that's bald? aren't they worth saving their image? are they worth less than someone with a home? are you KIDDING ME?
oh. and yes, the woman on my picture perfect blog had been homeless. the picture is almost 25 years old.. and if you look at the photo and say, "wow, she's homeless" you completely miss the person, who she is, the life she lived, how she loved.
if you look at her photo and say "wow.. homeless.. that's just wrong" you have completely diminished her worth. how dare you!
i believe.. or, i live under the belief that i must know how others live.. that includes images, their stories, their joy and their heartache. to give anyone anything less.. is to diminish who they are and the life they live.
i can't. i won't.
and so.. my life's photo album contains people who are homeless.. it is a reality, a harsh reality.
a photo of a homeless person for a competition? hmm.. i suppose, why not? because, for just a moment you knew them. if you go beyond the photo.. if you read the words, if you *clicked* and read a part of her life story in the link provided.. then for just a moment you could look in her face and know: they are someone's child. perhaps a parent, sibling, treasured friend.
mostly, you can look in their face and know.. it could be you. "there but for the grace of God..."
if all you do is look at the picture on my blog and say, oh. homeless person... then you are the one that misses the point.
she was homeless.
she was also, for a time, my roommate. she was my joy and my frustration.. mostly, she was also my friend. when i posted the photo.. when i look at the photo.. every time i see her face, i weep at the loss of her in my life.
you, see a homeless woman.
i.. i see rosalie.
and yes jack, i know you just got home and this isn't referring to any particular picture. this, is just my own humble opinion.
Luci, I would like to just leave this for the evening if this is alright now I know your meaning is well, but lets not keep this going in here please. I don't think anyone is playing any games and perhaps it's best to just leave this for tonight...seemingly without really knowing it I opened up a can of worms but didnt mean too. As the saying goes to each there own.
Tess, you're getting feisty. All of the comments & conversations involve me. You've done this before, & literally put words in my mouth. Sorry, Jack. You haven't degraded anyone, but if Tess is going to be abrasive, (as often she is), I'm leaving. I don't play games.
honestly...Jack I have no idea where all of this is coming from..... i dont even know this peson....
Each person I have had on my blog I have on here for a good intention....I need not say anymore...I thought I would get on here and do a write as a night cap. This was a moral question and as basic as it is the question is merely a question as you have answered it in your own way- thank you.
In all of these confusions ... only one lesson is learned, "how much love we put into our hearts" if that will be answered in the most honest and humble ways ... then no one, in his/her right mind will use anyones pictures much less their flight just to get attention. If we are in their shoes how we would feel. Using others poverty is an unthinkable way to put them more into a more shameful manner. If we have the will and means of helping them in the most respectful manners then let us all do it ... no funfare. That is LOVE in its highest form.
Taking a picture is usually for a personal reason ... we all take pictures of something that either interests us or is beautiful to us. I have taken pictures of a group of homeless people. Although I found their circumstances shocking and sad ... they were all content and happy with their lot! There was dirt and litter and no running water ... but they all welcomed me with a friendly smile and a certain amount of pride. The reasons I captured all this poverty and dirt was because one of the members of this group was my daughters father! And yes ... my intention was to capture it all so that should the need ever arise one day ..... my daughter can be shown the truth of what happens when one abuses the system and ones health! This is just my reasons ... and yes I did blog about it about two years ago ... and I did show my pictures .... but the message was perfectly clear. Knowledge is what makes a wise man ... and knowing the truth about our world and its people makes for understanding and eliminates judgement.
One person or a group (or shots of several?) A man who maybe ashamed of his position or one who understands and accepts his position ? That would make a difference to me.
There are over 100 million homeless people,” reports the United Nations. If that figure is accurate, then 1 human in every 60 or so is without adequate shelter. We can't pretend they are not there. I have pictures I took when traveling, conditions that were shocking. As Lynne mentioned. many didn't mind. They found contentment. Lynne had a reason I accept that.
It is evident that all the homeless need help—not just physical help but also the kind that can soothe their hearts and lift their spirits. Such help can empower people to face and overcome many of the problems that contribute to homelessness. I think we all can help there. There is always going to be some poor. It is impossible to save all from such conditions as much as we would like too.. We can help them in many ways. Some we just enable them to stay homeless by State support and that isn't good. With all the groups and agencies opening--this is becoming more of a growing problem--it's not getting better.
Since homelessness is widespread, someone you know may be affected by it. Perhaps they or someone who knows them might find that offensive, hurtful--that could be understandable, don't you think? What if you just became homeless through some misfortune not of your own--would you like your picture on as blog? For your family and friends to see? It could be a sticky situation. I volunteer at some shelters at times. Teens seem very sensitive to pictures of them or their family. I think some blogs have made people more aware Hundreds of thousands live on the city streets of India. Pictures can be found many places. My view is, morally or ethically - I would use great caution on such pictures. I think that would be wise.
Thanks Haddie this did take on some problems but for the most part now they are all resolved... I have to get to bed here shortly as I will but up early but there is one within Iraq I assisted, one here that was homeless that came back from Afganastan and another that was within NY some years ago. Morally and ethically I would not run out to take a picture of a homeless person, this is really what I think. I think that our fabric and code of ethics are far too high to do things as such.
I agree with you Had ... but it goes with any picture one may take really .... some people dont mind having their pictures taken ... while others do. Whenever I see the pictures depicting animal cruelty I shudder with horror ... but the message is imbedded in my mind ... sometimes people just need to see something before they fully understand. Shock treatment so to speak. I guess its all in how its portrayed .... what the actual message is. Homeless people are a reality and the more people hear about it the more chance there is of change. Pictures speak louder than words sometimes ....... I have seen the poorest of souls living under cardboard boxes ..... yet they offer the warmest smile imaginable ..... I do agree though it depends on the individual .... and it all boils down to consideration and respect!
ummm, actually - I've had - on occassion, I ate worms when there was nothin else to eat in some areas of raq and afghan and we couldn't give away our position - just say'n, I woulda rather gone fishin with the worms - but things be'n what they were, that was all we had to eat.
That's something I haven't done yet since be'n home - to go fishin.
Interesting isn't it how personal a lot of reaction to the question is. to each his/ her own i guess. My Cousin is a world renown photo journalist , in fact if he had not shot pictures of President Reagan being shot the world would never have seem it and he did it without permission. Next I did not know there is a competition, do you guys actually have prizes for posting interesting pictures? Keep taking pictures and keep showing them, this is a good way to see the world for people like me.
No matter if a person is homeless or not...If my intent is to feature them.... post their pic on the net or use it for my own gain then I ask them if it is okay......only times I don't is if I am taking a pic into a crowd of people then obviously I don't ask because I am not featuring any one person.....If it's a famous person like the reference to Reagan up there then I wouldn't ask....they know people photograph them everywhere they go.....unless I was dealing with them face to face on a personal level then I'd ask....Not saying I'm handling things in right way....just how I handle it....this is a good question Jack...it's interesting to me to see everyone's thoughts on it.....For the most part I feel a little weird photographing folks on the street..unless they are at an event that they know will be photographed....probably the reason I stick to Nature Photography because I do not want to infringe on anyone's rights & privacy....from all the comments it shows me there is a lot of gray area on this subject.
You have just posted a very interesting topic there Tee. Because what I know, once you entered something liked a competion of some sort, the photos becomes properties of whatever groups it may be. And who knows, after sometimes you'll see all those beautiful shots properly put into a hardboundbooks and sold in a bookstore. And what happened to the real owners of that pictures ...
No worries all is fine Tess. I was up till 3am fixing things up in here. I guess I should have not gone out as it was a first within a while. Last night that is but if you need or wish to block someone her nick was Scootch2 < id.
I have three stories to write and I shall today. One is with regard to a unfortunate person from Iraq that came out of it well and wasnt homeless but was homebound - due to some help from myself and family we at the time were able to get her into Reuters and then from there she lived within camps as Reuters is a news agency made up of many different countries - now she has her own apartment and was pomoted to be editor within Singapore.
I hammed it up in NYC, and I am going to use that picture to explain what I believe in. Who does take a picture is there own choice my point with this was not to blemish a group nor a person(s) but to question and see wht the morality and ethical codes of some are. I would never go out and take a picture of somone that is either mentally ill, addicted or economically surprised. Most that are homeless are mentally ill and that is a sickness. I don't see it as being in no manner shape or form correct. So for myself I would never do it either Cath.
No we don't get a thing for posting pictures but this weeks theme was a little risky if you ask me as it was left very general, it was called Urban Decay....most all went with buildings that were left to go Tee. And many had a hard time with it and didnt participate. I have known you a long time and I am not deleting you I feel that you have some good wisdom there and Tee you are one that thinks for herself - PM me when you have time....a great day to you as I should be at the gym but I have to take a family member into see his medical results this afternoon. So I am looking to start something which would be a rather neat group and ran by five people, and I would just lay down the foundation.
I used to post to PP but never seem to find the time any more. When I saw this note, I read it quite quickly and responded without a great deal of thought, I just repeated my initial thoughts and reactions, I didn't know this was a response to PP or to any ones picture in particular. What I said I meant, but I guess it was a generalisation and not tailored to any specific situation. I have to say if I had known at the time that this note was provoked by photographs some of the PP participants had posted, maybe I would have given more thought to my answer and maybe I would have chosen not to answer at all. Maybe it wasn't the intent of any one but I almost feel as if I have been involved unwittingly in heated discussions about people I know and in some cases are quite fond of. Again, I'm not blaming any one, but I do feel as if I have somehow been duped into taking sides in an argument I wasn't aware was happening. I think maybe if would have been better to phrase this question along the lines of...........how do my friends feel about the photographs of homeless people being used in this weeks PP competition' If that were the case, I would have known exactly what i was being drawn into. Like I said, no criticism of any one in particular, I just feel a little misled.
Lorretta as of today this is all forgotten...The one and only reason for the note was with regards to my own questions not by way of one or two people but how we look at things within our society and what are moral codes are.
what i "enjoyed" of this exchange, is reading the viewpoints of others. we only learn to make our own informed decisions when we look at something from all sides. while i enjoy picture perfect, and have been involved since week one back on yahoo, i approach it differently (and had actually said that before you ever posted your note). i use photos i already have.. for me, the challenge is in fitting the theme to a moment i've lived and not rushing out to live a moment within the theme. my life has already been filled with images and moments worth sharing - it's why i am here. ooooooh.. and i HATE the "competition mode" (which heather knows cuz i complain every time). i just enjoy seeing how others interpret a theme, the images in their world, the journey their life has taken.
i'm sorry greg's worm comment is gone. back when my blog photo was taken, we would make a regular excursion to dunkin donuts every once in a while for a morning treat. we'd have to go at 4 a.m. when we know it would be empty. we'd go with large green trash bags and head around back, silently climbing into the dumpster to fill the bags with treats. (if you have a weak stomach, feel free to stop reading now and jump to the next paragraph) we'd dig through napkins and cigarette butts to find what had been tossed. luckily, thankfully, they were usually dumped all at once so only the outside donuts would have ashes and dirt. inside.. were the treasured donuts! you learned to measure your distaste, by how many ashes you had to brush off that last remaining treat.
strangely, when i can afford to go to dunkin donuts now.. it just isn't as good as those treasured treats before.
If the blog's purpose is to (further) bring to light the impoverished plight of the homeless, and the individual(s) being photographed have given their permission, then I would say it's okay.. Unemployment is at an all-time high, and consequently more and more homes are going into foreclosure resulting in a tremendous surge in homelessness. . Thousands are being forced out of their homes to live on the streets, and, sadly, most of our politicians seem indifferent to the suffering in this country. They're too preoccupied with the November elections!
The key question in my mind would be "what is the purpose for posting a picture of the homeless on one's blog?" As we all know, a picture says a thousand words, and they help to get a point across when words are not sufficient.
A very thought-provoking question, Jack. We need to shed more light on the seriousness of this problem. Thank you for posting such an important question. :)
This was just a thought that I threw out there and I am going to hopefully write a story with regards to how people rebounded after having turmoil as such within my next blog. I thank you all...
Umm, dang, I hope I didn't offend anyone with my worm comment. In military training that my unit had, we did have to eat off the land, worms happen to be "off (if not in) the land. I meant nothing more by eating worms then - "we actually had to eat worms to get protein to survive". Water was another problem,
I wouldn't wish what my men in my unit endured - on anyone. I lost 2 of my men on this 4th tour in afghan. That was and is the most difficult event in my life and in the lives of their families (my family) who survive them. Their military funerals were - to say the least - emotional.
Anyhow, I'd agree with sweetferd - if ya got worms available, do NOT eat em for protein, go fishin with em. Fishin's good for the soul, it gives the soul time to reflect. Reflection is good. Too many folks try to see thru a mirror - what's on the other side?
God bless all y'alls.
If ya climb in the saddle - be ready for the ride, giddyup, hooah **++
i certainly found no offense.. i was sorry because i think its important for others to know the life that is behind anothers eyes. eating worms, was just another facet of your life. i taught english to a vietnamese family years and years ago.. they were ashamed of the times they had to eat rats in a detention camp before coming to the states. their heads would hang at the thought but then humbly said they owed their lives to those rats for their sustenance.
you also reminded me to go check on my friends son.. he's in the first months of ranger camp at benning and he was sure it wasn't gonna be a problem lol. silly youth.
meet me at the fishing pond.. i'll bring bait. thank you greg, for your service **==
Hm, I think you should ask their permission.
ReplyDeleteLanie, I may expand on this one, meanwhile just preparing supper and it's a great day, I would never do it, not in my life.
ReplyDeleteyes but would let them know.
ReplyDeletei agree!
ReplyDeleteTo each there own Arielle....I have my reservations on this...
ReplyDeleteI would, after getting their permission and given them a few bucks.
ReplyDeleteThat idea I would agree with Sue...to some extent. I think you know where this is coming from...
ReplyDeleteI'm conflicted on this question.
ReplyDeleteMy first response is, definitely not. It would feel so disrespectful, even denigrating.
Next...some of us need to actually see what is happening to people here...to be informed, to be actively involved.
But. This would only be combined with an editorial, not used in a theme.
I'll maintain my first response. I would give them something to eat, or money, but NOT an exchange for taking their picture.
Only if your doing it to bring attention to the problem....
ReplyDeleteJulie, that's exactly what I meant:
ReplyDelete"Next...some of us need to actually see what is happening to people here...to be informed, to be actively involved.
But. This would only be combined with an editorial, not used in a theme."
If I were in the position to do something like this, I'd explain it to them & be sure I had their total understanding & agreement.
Thanks Jules and Lucija...
ReplyDeletenot a picture I took myself of someone begging or homeless, I would be too embarrassed to take the photo in the first place, and i think the idea of taking the photo and then giving them a little money you don't need it is patronising, Its not your unwanted loose change they need but a home. But I have done blogs on poverty and homelessness and used photos found on the internet or on other related sites to illustrate what I mean.
ReplyDeleteWould you take a picture of the mayor and post it without his knowledge? Would you post a picture of your neighbors without their knowledge? Yes? Then you may do the same with a homeless man. No? Then no, you can't.
ReplyDeleteIt's very degrading and very unbecoming if its done for the purpose of just using it for a competition, but if its for a certain subject liked if your into reporting something to bring about their flight then it is alright.
ReplyDeletewhere did you see that picture if i may ask
ReplyDeleteWould you mind telling me what brought this question to your mind Jack?
ReplyDeletenevermind....i saw the picture......
ReplyDeletei will respond privately
I have shot pictures of homeless people before. Always with their permission and always attached to buying them a meal. In the case of many I have bought more then one meal. Steve, Steven and Ron are 3 homeless men I have photographed, spoken to and sat down and bought them breakfast before. It isn't degrading or disrespectful to take their picture, It is when people treat them as if they were a blight that they are disrespected. To pretend they don't exist brings more disrespect. Cathy is another homeless person I photographed. Including her home in the woods. It was a tent. I took her food every week and sat and talked while we ate lunch together in her home. When she was killed by a hit and run driver the pictures I took of her were the only things her family had for over a year. Knowing that she had a home and someone who was her friend gave comfort to her family.
ReplyDeleteBelieve it or not homeless people have pride in their ability to survive in the wild of the city. They do what many of us would not be capable of doing.
can i ask what you did with those pictures you took of homeless for a meal?
ReplyDeleteIt depends on how funny it is.
ReplyDeleteI do some photo journalist work. People usually don't get past a persons homelessness to know the story behind the person. Take Steve and his son Steven. Steve worked at a local hospital in their maintenance staff, until the hospital had cut backs. Before that he had a house with a wife. After he was laid off she got cancer and they didn't have insurance. She ended up on medicare and lived for over a year after diagnosis. For Steve trying to get his wife to chemo and job hunting. Then working a temp job while trying to get her too and from chemo didn't help him get and keep a job. By the time she died he was in a lot of debt and ended up losing his house. He and Steven were on the street. Once you are on the street it's harder to get a job, you don't have an address or a phone number. So they go to the corner where day laborers are picked up. Steve's in his 50s so many people don't want a day laborer his age. Steven is in his early 20's so he gets more jobs. They met Ron on the street and he taught them the ropes. They became good friends,. Ron, Steve and Steven look out for each other. If one gets a day labor job they can all eat for a day. They hope one day they can all get jobs and be able to get a place together. Until then they all sleep in a parking garage at night. The story behind the pictures. The men behind the pictures
ReplyDeletewhat could possibly be funny?
ReplyDeleteA paid job I suppose.....? I am just curious, thats why I ask.
ReplyDeleteNo it isn't a paid job. I am currently doing a photo journal piece on the flight 93 memorial and the creation of the permanent memorial. There are many people who blog about the human condition and the plight of humanity to get the story out. In the case of th flight 93 memorial because the day the plane crashed changed so many lives. Not just the families of those on the plane. the people who live in the area have been permanently affected by this act. Yet without a voice, no one knows.
ReplyDeleteThe homeless have no voice but they should. What I have found is that many of the people who live on the streets are not much different from anyone else. Most of us have no idea how close we are to falling over the edge and being next to them in the line at a soup kitchen.
Exactly my thought - I just arrived home here Loretta...
ReplyDeleteFrani I think you might already know yet I was out and just arrived home and it's a ethics and moral question...
ReplyDeleteWhat picture is this?
ReplyDeleteyou are well what can I say I am out of here period --this is a direct jab at my picture and yes I take this as a vaer personal afront
ReplyDeleteHeidi, I have not seen your picture as of yet...
ReplyDeletethank you that is how I feel --if we don't speak for them who will ?He is taking a jab at m picture but I can dellet and will and him not the homeless
ReplyDeletethat I do not believe sorry
ReplyDeleteDo as you wish Heidi, literally I have never seen you blog nor any of your pictures I have been out with my cousin and her friend.
ReplyDeleteDont play these games on my blog Heidi.
ReplyDeletei just went and looked at your blog photo and short of you saying the person depicted was homeless, i would never presume that. all of the bags could also mean plenty of things.
ReplyDeleteOk it was a question I posed before I had supper and then I headed out and literally just arrived home ten minutes ago. So I am just reading this it's merely a question. So am reading and placing on my glasses.
ReplyDeleteOk Tess.
ReplyDeleteit is not speaking for them when you post the picture of a homeless person on a blog page for a contest.....In my opinion.
ReplyDeleteif your an advocate for anything....speak of it often...make changes....do what you can....always.
let it be said when you are spoken of that you fought for this or that.....
we can all take a sneaked picture of a homeless person and say it is a shame.....
but saying i volunteer weekly at a shelter to feed these people , well that is different.
I have not seen Heidi's picture and that is a fact, there is no need for me to defend myself with this one nor do I wish to see it, it was a moral and ethical question period.
ReplyDeletei think it is what it is....
ReplyDeletethere will always be those who say i took that photo so they can be heard.....or seen in this instance.....
and really, there but for the grace of God go any of us.....
and there will be those who say there is nothing wrong......its a picture.
to each his own....and....oh ya.... kharma is , well you know.
Since I have no idea what picture anyone is speaking of it is hard to say. It is interesting that it caused this conversation. I find it interesting that taking a picture of a homeless person is viewed as exploitation. Would taking a picture of a person running across the finish line of a race be exploitation? Is taking a picture of a people on a public beach exploitation? In other words if it is something positive or showing someone winning it isn't viewed as wrong, but a person sleeping in a drain pipe or a person with a sign on a street is viewed as wrong. Yet this made everyone who commented think.
ReplyDeletetaking a picture of someone elses suffering for a contest...yep i have issues with that. im human....
ReplyDeletethe first homeless i saw was a few months ago in philadelphia.....and i cried for days over it. i ahd my camera in my hand in the car as we drove under the bridge....and it was a photo i passed on taking.
I was not talking about one or any pictures in particular, nor have I seen Heidi's page. I literally just arrived home here and before I had supper and then went out unexpectedly as my cousin called me to go out for a coffee with her and her friend, I literally just got in here Sharon. Perhaps I shouldnt have asked the ethical question.
ReplyDeleteif we dont ask what rattles around how will we grow?
ReplyDeleteFrani, I had supper then went out and after participating in PP I had this question, yet in no manner did I look at Heidi's picture.
ReplyDeleteThat is honestly the truth and I will not go and see it everyone can see whom visits there page and I never saw Heidi's page in fact I opened this up and in no manner was I pointing anything out, I was really thinking about the homeless and the current theme within PP. Nothing more nor less.
Unfortunately there are homeless in every city,
ReplyDeleteJack I think it is a good question. I hope people remember it. I am one of those nut jobs who will stop and talk to people. It is when we turn our heads or walk on by that dehumanizes them. These people are people. The get hungry, they feel cold, they hate when someone looks at them and looks away embarrassed to have looked. It is an act of human kindness that allows them to know people still care. Even a cheese sandwich means so much to them. A bottle of water on a hot day. It is the small acts that they appreciate.
honestly, there were a few homeless pictured for PP, hers was not the only one
ReplyDeleteI have several still waiting to be looked at but this was a moral question...Tess. This is something to log into but so be it.
ReplyDeleteOnce in a while I will ask questions just to see what people think, not just within PP. I am not going to feed a fire and never
meant to nor will embark with games played....
And that was all it was...I am not into this gossip thing and I have just done some deletes as it was merely a question Sharon.
ReplyDeleteI understand that it was only a question. I'm seriously not into games. I was judging this as a morality question. But if my input isn't wanted I won't comment.
ReplyDeletedeep breaths everyone.....its a question......if comments werent wanted....the comment section would not be open to
ReplyDeleteThanks to all for giving there input...
ReplyDeletewell, I reckon that sometimes - things are what they are. On my 3rd tour in raq, I was able to blog sometimes. A few folks asked me to put some pictures on or with my blogs of what "actually happened" over there. Better judgement didn't allow me to post very graphic pictures, however, after some requests, I did post 1 or 2 or 3 pics of some events. They're probably still in some of my 5 albums. I was not asked by anyone to take them off - and so I did not. Graphic is all a matter of one's own thought process. You might think that a soldier may or may not ever get used to seeing some of the things we are exposed to. I can't answer for everyone, but it's always difficult - if you have the time to stop and reason. Much of what we did was training oriented and sometimes it's best to not go back and revisit those events.
ReplyDeleteMyself, I'd probably not take a picture to share with anyone on a blog, however, I might take a picture of some homeless person if I had a personal interest in his/her situation - but it would be just for me. Kinda difficult to share most of the things I've seen and been exposed to - I doubt I ever will.
If ya see a fellow human in need - and if you can somehow find it in yerself to better their situation - ya owe it to yerself to take care of what needs to be done.
God bless all y'alls. Hooah **== ,
just greg
Read my mind, as that was something I was thinking about along with all of this - ironic isn't it...
ReplyDeletethank you.....
ReplyDeleteOh, wow. What could be funny about a homeless person? That was mean.
ReplyDeleteI've been told of an old "joke."
"Hire the handicapped, it's fun to watch them work."
God. That isn't a funny joke at all.
Would YOU be "funny" if you lived in a cardboard box under a freeway? If you had MS?
I don't believe this!
I like what you told us, & I thought that somewhere in this thread, I said I'd like to talk with them...understand how they feel. The "intimacy" you express makes much difference.
ReplyDeleteThis, too: "To pretend they don't exist brings more disrespect."
Oh, Tess, that's not what she said at all!
ReplyDeleteit isnt?
ReplyDeletedid she not say she took photos of them, then took them for a meal?
I admire what you do.
ReplyDeleteYou aren't just shooting pictures of homeless people, you're involved. That's the start, & if more people knew why there are so many homeless, perhaps we could do something about it?
replyjadedruid wrote on Aug 25
ReplyDeleteI have shot pictures of homeless people before. Always with their permission and always attached to buying them a meal.
Please read ALL of what she said before making judgments.
ReplyDeleteYes Lucija, I didnt arrive here tonight to degrade anyone. I literally just arrived home an hour ago now.
ReplyDeleteperhaps you should as well.....
ReplyDeletewhat judgements did I make.....she wrote that she takes photos and provides a meal to do so.... some floks she gives extra meals to and talks to them and learns about them on a more personal basis.
i asked her what it was she did with the photos....as i was curious.
it seems you are judging a conversation that didnt involve you
"adedruid wrote today at 7:38 PM
ReplyDeleteI do some photo journalist work. People usually don't get past a persons homelessness to know the story behind the person. Take Steve and his son Steven. Steve worked at a local hospital in their maintenance staff, until the hospital had cut backs. Before that he had a house with a wife. After he was laid off she got cancer and they didn't have insurance. She ended up on medicare and lived for over a year after diagnosis. For Steve trying to get his wife to chemo and job hunting. Then working a temp job while trying to get her too and from chemo didn't help him get and keep a job. By the time she died he was in a lot of debt and ended up losing his house. He and Steven were on the street. Once you are on the street it's harder to get a job, you don't have an address or a phone number. So they go to the corner where day laborers are picked up. Steve's in his 50s so many people don't want a day laborer his age. Steven is in his early 20's so he gets more jobs. They met Ron on the street and he taught them the ropes. They became good friends,. Ron, Steve and Steven look out for each other. If one gets a day labor job they can all eat for a day. They hope one day they can all get jobs and be able to get a place together. Until then they all sleep in a parking garage at night. The story behind the pictures. The men behind the pictures"
nitiativestain wrote today at 9:32 PM
Yes Lucija, I didnt arrive here tonight to degrade anyone. I literally just arrived home an hour ago now."
Tess, you're getting feisty. All of the comments & conversations involve me. You've done this before, & literally put words in my mouth.
Sorry, Jack. You haven't degraded anyone, but if Tess is going to be abrasive, (as often she is), I'm leaving. I don't play games.
um, as often as I am? who are you.... i dont know you.... never have seen you ....
ReplyDeletebut let me say this.... if you shove me,..... i will shove back.... much harder....
*takes a deep breath*
ReplyDeletemy answer, is yes.
why wouldn't i take a picture of a homeless person? a person with a disability? a person that's fat? a person that's bald? aren't they worth saving their image? are they worth less than someone with a home? are you KIDDING ME?
oh. and yes, the woman on my picture perfect blog had been homeless. the picture is almost 25 years old.. and if you look at the photo and say, "wow, she's homeless" you completely miss the person, who she is, the life she lived, how she loved.
if you look at her photo and say "wow.. homeless.. that's just wrong" you have completely diminished her worth. how dare you!
i believe.. or, i live under the belief that i must know how others live.. that includes images, their stories, their joy and their heartache. to give anyone anything less.. is to diminish who they are and the life they live.
i can't. i won't.
and so.. my life's photo album contains people who are homeless.. it is a reality, a harsh reality.
a photo of a homeless person for a competition? hmm.. i suppose, why not? because, for just a moment you knew them. if you go beyond the photo.. if you read the words, if you *clicked* and read a part of her life story in the link provided.. then for just a moment you could look in her face and know: they are someone's child. perhaps a parent, sibling, treasured friend.
mostly, you can look in their face and know.. it could be you.
"there but for the grace of God..."
if all you do is look at the picture on my blog and say, oh. homeless person... then you are the one that misses the point.
she was homeless.
she was also, for a time, my roommate. she was my joy and my frustration.. mostly, she was also my friend. when i posted the photo.. when i look at the photo.. every time i see her face, i weep at the loss of her in my life.
you, see a homeless woman.
i.. i see rosalie.
and yes jack, i know you just got home and this isn't referring to any particular picture. this, is just my own humble opinion.
Luci, I would like to just leave this for the evening if this is alright now I know your meaning is well, but lets not keep this going in here please. I don't think anyone is playing any games and perhaps it's best to just leave this for tonight...seemingly without really knowing it I opened up a can of worms but didnt mean too. As the saying goes to each there own.
ReplyDeleteTess, you're getting feisty. All of the comments & conversations involve me. You've done this before, & literally put words in my mouth.
ReplyDeleteSorry, Jack. You haven't degraded anyone, but if Tess is going to be abrasive, (as often she is), I'm leaving. I don't play games.
honestly...Jack I have no idea where all of this is coming from..... i dont even know this peson....
*smiles* when you open a can of worms the best thing to do.. is go fishin'
ReplyDeleteEach person I have had on my blog I have on here for a good intention....I need not say anymore...I thought I would get on here and do a write as a night cap. This was a moral question and as basic as it is the question is merely a question as you have answered it in your own way- thank you.
ReplyDeleteuggggh
ReplyDeleteLucija, please stop...Tess is a decent person as are you.
ReplyDeleteIn all of these confusions ... only one lesson is learned, "how much love we put into our hearts" if that will be answered in the most honest and humble ways ... then no one, in his/her right mind will use anyones pictures much less their flight just to get attention. If we are in their shoes how we would feel. Using others poverty is an unthinkable way to put them more into a more shameful manner. If we have the will and means of helping them in the most respectful manners then let us all do it ... no funfare. That is LOVE in its highest form.
ReplyDeleteMy hugs.
maritess*
No it's one person that really started the entire thread... Just one.
ReplyDeleteTake a deep breath ... its night time. Smile ... tomorrow is another day. Blessings and tight hugs
ReplyDeleteTaking a picture is usually for a personal reason ... we all take pictures of something that either interests us or is beautiful to us.
ReplyDeleteI have taken pictures of a group of homeless people. Although I found their circumstances shocking and sad ... they were all content and happy with their lot! There was dirt and litter and no running water ... but they all welcomed me with a friendly smile and a certain amount of pride. The reasons I captured all this poverty and dirt was because one of the members of this group was my daughters father! And yes ... my intention was to capture it all so that should the need ever arise one day ..... my daughter can be shown the truth of what happens when one abuses the system and ones health!
This is just my reasons ... and yes I did blog about it about two years ago ... and I did show my pictures .... but the message was perfectly clear. Knowledge is what makes a wise man ... and knowing the truth about our world and its people makes for understanding and eliminates judgement.
Thanks Lynne...and it does.
ReplyDeleteOne person or a group (or shots of several?) A man who maybe ashamed of his position or one who understands and accepts his position ? That would make a difference to me.
ReplyDeleteThere are over 100 million homeless people,” reports the United Nations. If that figure is accurate, then 1 human in every 60 or so is without adequate shelter. We can't pretend they are not there.
I have pictures I took when traveling, conditions that were shocking. As Lynne mentioned. many didn't mind. They found contentment.
Lynne had a reason I accept that.
It is evident that all the homeless need help—not just physical help but also the kind that can soothe their hearts and lift their spirits. Such help can empower people to face and overcome many of the problems that contribute to homelessness. I think we all can help there. There is always going to be some poor. It is impossible to save all from such conditions as much as we would like too.. We can help them in many ways. Some we just enable them to stay homeless by State support and that isn't good.
With all the groups and agencies opening--this is becoming more of a growing problem--it's not getting better.
Since homelessness is widespread, someone you know may be affected by it. Perhaps they or someone who knows them might find that offensive, hurtful--that could be understandable, don't you think? What if you just became homeless through some misfortune not of your own--would you like your picture on as blog? For your family and friends to see? It could be a sticky situation. I volunteer at some shelters at times. Teens seem very sensitive to pictures of them or their family. I think some blogs have made people more aware
Hundreds of thousands live on the city streets of India. Pictures can be found many places. My view is, morally or ethically - I would use great caution on such pictures. I think that would be wise.
Thanks Haddie this did take on some problems but for the most part now they are all resolved...
ReplyDeleteI have to get to bed here shortly as I will but up early but there is one within Iraq I assisted, one here that was homeless that came back from Afganastan and another that was within NY some years ago. Morally and ethically I would not run out to take a picture of a homeless person, this is really what I think. I think that our fabric and code of ethics are far too high to do things as such.
I agree with you Had ... but it goes with any picture one may take really .... some people dont mind having their pictures taken ... while others do.
ReplyDeleteWhenever I see the pictures depicting animal cruelty I shudder with horror ... but the message is imbedded in my mind ... sometimes people just need to see something before they fully understand. Shock treatment so to speak. I guess its all in how its portrayed .... what the actual message is. Homeless people are a reality and the more people hear about it the more chance there is of change.
Pictures speak louder than words sometimes ....... I have seen the poorest of souls living under cardboard boxes ..... yet they offer the warmest smile imaginable .....
I do agree though it depends on the individual .... and it all boils down to consideration and respect!
I never take anyone's picture without their permission.
ReplyDeleteummm, actually - I've had - on occassion, I ate worms when there was nothin else to eat in some areas of raq and afghan and we couldn't give away our position - just say'n, I woulda rather gone fishin with the worms - but things be'n what they were, that was all we had to eat.
ReplyDeleteThat's something I haven't done yet since be'n home - to go fishin.
Interesting isn't it how personal a lot of reaction to the question is. to each his/ her own i guess. My Cousin is a world renown photo journalist , in fact if he had not shot pictures of President Reagan being shot the world would never have seem it and he did it without permission. Next I did not know there is a competition, do you guys actually have prizes for posting interesting pictures? Keep taking pictures and keep showing them, this is a good way to see the world for people like me.
ReplyDeleteNo matter if a person is homeless or not...If my intent is to feature them.... post their pic on the net or use it for my own gain then I ask them if it is okay......only times I don't is if I am taking a pic into a crowd of people then obviously I don't ask because I am not featuring any one person.....If it's a famous person like the reference to Reagan up there then I wouldn't ask....they know people photograph them everywhere they go.....unless I was dealing with them face to face on a personal level then I'd ask....Not saying I'm handling things in right way....just how I handle it....this is a good question Jack...it's interesting to me to see everyone's thoughts on it.....For the most part I feel a little weird photographing folks on the street..unless they are at an event that they know will be photographed....probably the reason I stick to Nature Photography because I do not want to infringe on anyone's rights & privacy....from all the comments it shows me there is a lot of gray area on this subject.
ReplyDeleteYou have just posted a very interesting topic there Tee. Because what I know, once you entered something liked a competion of some sort, the photos becomes properties of whatever groups it may be. And who knows, after sometimes you'll see all those beautiful shots properly put into a hardboundbooks and sold in a bookstore. And what happened to the real owners of that pictures ...
ReplyDelete... your guess is as good as mine.
She is off and deleted ----------- just to let you know.
ReplyDeleteIt's the only way it should be if you I feel Geo....
ReplyDeleteNo worries all is fine Tess. I was up till 3am fixing things up in here. I guess I should have not gone out as it was a first within a while. Last night that is but if you need or wish to block someone her nick was Scootch2 < id.
ReplyDeleteI have three stories to write and I shall today. One is with regard to a unfortunate person from Iraq that came out of it well and wasnt homeless but was homebound - due to some help from myself and family we at the time were able to get her into Reuters and then from there she lived within camps as Reuters is a news agency made up of many different countries - now she has her own apartment and was pomoted to be editor within Singapore.
ReplyDeleteI hammed it up in NYC, and I am going to use that picture to explain what I believe in. Who does take a picture is there own choice my point with this was not to blemish a group nor a person(s) but to question and see wht the morality and ethical codes of some are.
I would never go out and take a picture of somone that is either mentally ill, addicted or economically surprised. Most that are homeless are mentally ill and that is a sickness. I don't see it as being in no manner shape or form correct. So for myself I would never do it either Cath.
No we don't get a thing for posting pictures but this weeks theme was a little risky if you ask me as it was left very general, it was called Urban Decay....most all went with buildings that were left to go Tee. And many had a hard time with it and didnt participate. I have known you a long time and I am not deleting you I feel that you have some good wisdom there and Tee you are one that thinks for herself - PM me when you have time....a great day to you as I should be at the gym but I have to take a family member into see his medical results this afternoon. So I am looking to start something which would be a rather neat group and ran by five people, and I would just lay down the foundation.
ReplyDeleteI used to post to PP but never seem to find the time any more. When I saw this note, I read it quite quickly and responded without a great deal of thought, I just repeated my initial thoughts and reactions, I didn't know this was a response to PP or to any ones picture in particular. What I said I meant, but I guess it was a generalisation and not tailored to any specific situation. I have to say if I had known at the time that this note was provoked by photographs some of the PP participants had posted, maybe I would have given more thought to my answer and maybe I would have chosen not to answer at all. Maybe it wasn't the intent of any one but I almost feel as if I have been involved unwittingly in heated discussions about people I know and in some cases are quite fond of. Again, I'm not blaming any one, but I do feel as if I have somehow been duped into taking sides in an argument I wasn't aware was happening. I think maybe if would have been better to phrase this question along the lines of...........how do my friends feel about the photographs of homeless people being used in this weeks PP competition' If that were the case, I would have known exactly what i was being drawn into.
ReplyDeleteLike I said, no criticism of any one in particular, I just feel a little misled.
Lorretta as of today this is all forgotten...The one and only reason for the note was with regards to my own questions not by way of one or two people but how we look at things within our society and what are moral codes are.
ReplyDeletewhat i "enjoyed" of this exchange, is reading the viewpoints of others. we only learn to make our own informed decisions when we look at something from all sides. while i enjoy picture perfect, and have been involved since week one back on yahoo, i approach it differently (and had actually said that before you ever posted your note). i use photos i already have.. for me, the challenge is in fitting the theme to a moment i've lived and not rushing out to live a moment within the theme. my life has already been filled with images and moments worth sharing - it's why i am here. ooooooh.. and i HATE the "competition mode" (which heather knows cuz i complain every time). i just enjoy seeing how others interpret a theme, the images in their world, the journey their life has taken.
ReplyDeletei'm sorry greg's worm comment is gone. back when my blog photo was taken, we would make a regular excursion to dunkin donuts every once in a while for a morning treat. we'd have to go at 4 a.m. when we know it would be empty. we'd go with large green trash bags and head around back, silently climbing into the dumpster to fill the bags with treats. (if you have a weak stomach, feel free to stop reading now and jump to the next paragraph) we'd dig through napkins and cigarette butts to find what had been tossed. luckily, thankfully, they were usually dumped all at once so only the outside donuts would have ashes and dirt. inside.. were the treasured donuts! you learned to measure your distaste, by how many ashes you had to brush off that last remaining treat.
strangely, when i can afford to go to dunkin donuts now.. it just isn't as good as those treasured treats before.
good morning jack :)
If the blog's purpose is to (further) bring to light the impoverished plight of the homeless, and the individual(s) being photographed have given their permission, then I would say it's okay.. Unemployment is at an all-time high, and consequently more and more homes are going into foreclosure resulting in a tremendous surge in homelessness. . Thousands are being forced out of their homes to live on the streets, and, sadly, most of our politicians seem indifferent to the suffering in this country. They're too preoccupied with the November elections!
ReplyDeleteThe key question in my mind would be "what is the purpose for posting a picture of the homeless on one's blog?" As we all know, a picture says a thousand words, and they help to get a point across when words are not sufficient.
A very thought-provoking question, Jack. We need to shed more light on the seriousness of this problem. Thank you for posting such an important question. :)
no need to block anyone....i am fine....and hugs for your consideration
ReplyDeleteThis was just a thought that I threw out there and I am going to hopefully write a story with regards to how people rebounded after having turmoil as such within my next blog.
ReplyDeleteI thank you all...
This was my intention after writing this note last night...nothing more and nothing less:
ReplyDeletehttp://initiativestain.multiply.com/journal/item/1128/How_People_Overcome_Obstacles
Umm, dang, I hope I didn't offend anyone with my worm comment. In military training that my unit had, we did have to eat off the land, worms happen to be "off (if not in) the land. I meant nothing more by eating worms then - "we actually had to eat worms to get protein to survive". Water was another problem,
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't wish what my men in my unit endured - on anyone. I lost 2 of my men on this 4th tour in afghan. That was and is the most difficult event in my life and in the lives of their families (my family) who survive them. Their military funerals were - to say the least - emotional.
Anyhow, I'd agree with sweetferd - if ya got worms available, do NOT eat em for protein, go fishin with em. Fishin's good for the soul, it gives the soul time to reflect. Reflection is good. Too many folks try to see thru a mirror - what's on the other side?
God bless all y'alls.
If ya climb in the saddle - be ready for the ride, giddyup, hooah **++
What was your rank? And were you a Green Beret?
ReplyDeletei certainly found no offense.. i was sorry because i think its important for others to know the life that is behind anothers eyes. eating worms, was just another facet of your life. i taught english to a vietnamese family years and years ago.. they were ashamed of the times they had to eat rats in a detention camp before coming to the states. their heads would hang at the thought but then humbly said they owed their lives to those rats for their sustenance.
ReplyDeleteyou also reminded me to go check on my friends son.. he's in the first months of ranger camp at benning and he was sure it wasn't gonna be a problem lol. silly youth.
meet me at the fishing pond.. i'll bring bait. thank you greg, for your service **==